Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: chronicpain on July 12, 2011, 02:57 pm
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Here is the greatest opiate conversion that I know is out there. It's kind of funny, I told my doc about this and he now uses it regularly in his practice.
http://www.globalrph.com/narcoticonv.htm
Just so you know PO means by mouth. The others are pretty self explainable.
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Very good info. I saw something like this a few years back but the only thing I remembered was that hydrocodone was 90% as effective as oxycodone.
The good thing now is(well good that this chart is available bad everywhere else) , recently the DEA has come down hard on pain patients in Florida. This could be law or unofficial policy (DEA is very good at that here), but supposedly the limit on one of my medications got reduced 25% and that is the limit. My doctor told me this is because it's an IR med and he can replace whatever is missing (next month of coarse, fking bastard) with a long lasting med just let him know what to write.
This chart will be exactly what I need when I go back in a few weeks.
No just need to figure out what to convert to :)
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Wow, I really hope this is correct and that I did it right.
Was wondering what #60 30MG Oxycodone IR(1800mg) would be and it told me it's the same as 900mg of dilaudid?! That's insane if it's true. Means someone can get 225 K4's instead(4mgx225=900mg) of 60 roxies?
Is this correct? It also told me it's only 135mg of methadone, so 60 30's is to 13 and a half 10mg methadones? Yeah uh fuck that.
Do you know of any other charts to check?
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you have to remember that oxycodone (when taken orally) has a bioavailability of about 80 percent. Oxymorphone is 10 percent. I think dilaudid is in that range as well. but if you check it iv, then the numbers are totally different. dilaudid is 100 percent iv.
ITs all how you calculate it by method of ingestion, oxycodone, hydrocodone all have very high oral rates. Morphine, oxymorphone, hydromorphone, fentanyl, have very low oral rates but their iv rates are 100 percent.
When I did my calculations. If I did 4 30mg of oxycodone a day if I where to go to dilaudid I would have to take 82mg's. so orally, 120mg of oxycodone is equal to 45mg of dilaudid a day.
Also, you may need to check if it by mouth, iv or whatever.
And remember, some docs will calculate a cross tolerance. its used to prevent od's. So, they will usually drop the equivalent by 25 percent and then move you up.
Does that make sense?
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Chronicpain is right. I just never got the cross-tolerance issue quite right in my head.
Here's the charts I use. I didn't check Clay's calculations, but I know these three are right:
opiate bioavailability by ingestion route: http://taimapedia.org/index.php?title=Opiate_bioavailability
opiate dosage equivalents: http://www.medcalc.com/narcotics.html
opiate potentiation methods: http://opioids.com/opiates/index.html
I don't like the globalrph equivalency chart because you have to *correctly* gauge your cross-tolerance, which is nigh to impossible, for me.
the medcalc one simply tells you how much and also, kind of nice, the efficacy duration. Which is really good for people unfamiliar with
stronger opiates. The easiest way to die is to just want to "top off" and mistakenly depress your CNS into submission. Especially with fentanyl.
Hope this helps...
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You don't have to use the cross tolerance. It gives you the option and the option for the percent.
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You don't have to use the cross tolerance. It gives you the option and the option for the percent.
Quite right. That's what I've never figured out: how do you judge your cross-tolerance? Diminishing the dose by a factor of somewhere between 0-75% is a big deal. And the charts don't account for "off label" ingestion methods either. There's no comp value for IV oxycodone, for instance.
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heroine breaks down into morphine. oxycodone breaks down into oxymorphone. Hydrocodone breaks down into hyrdomorphone. Im not sure what methadone and Fentanyl break down to since they are synthetic. I believe codeine stays the same, codeine (not 100 percent sure on that one)
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Wow, that's what I get for posting when I'm almost asleep and opiated. I meant to say "morphones/morphine" and now I posted completely inaccurate info. I was being lazy, trying to keep it simple and avoid the details. :P Here's the full scoop:
All of them except morphine have to break down to cross the blood/brain barrier and get absorbed. The full breakdown is:
codeine, heroin, fentanyl = morphine
dilaudid, palladone = hydromorphone
oxycontin, roxicodone, percocet = oxycodone
They all bind to the brain's receptors (more or less) equally well; but the hydromorphs are lousy for oral ingestion due to low oral bioavailability. A regular opiate user will be very disappointed if they eat dilaudid or palladone. I know, I was. Also, fentanyl is 100X stronger than morphine so people have to mind the doses are in mcg not mg. Particularly when there's no filler, like when railing with the patches.
vicodin, norco, lortab=hydrocodone
Hydro is made from codeine or thebaine, another natural poppy narcotic, so it breaks down to morphine too. Hydro binds to the brain's receptors at about a 60% efficacy of the others which is why street value is usually "2mg hydro=1mg oxy" for simple conversion. When you make poppy tea the effect comes from codeine and thebaine too.
Besides the above, the high is determined by ingestion method and bioavailability. Anyone wanting to educate themselves should really check out the opiophile.org page. It was the old heads over there that educated me and also pointed me to good resource materials. Advice threads are a great start, but it's always best to find out for yourself.
Thanks @Chronicpain for posting. I'd hate to leave bad info up on a thread. :)
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Wow, I really hope this is correct and that I did it right.
Was wondering what #60 30MG Oxycodone IR(1800mg) would be and it told me it's the same as 900mg of dilaudid?! That's insane if it's true. Means someone can get 225 K4's instead(4mgx225=900mg) of 60 roxies?
Is this correct? It also told me it's only 135mg of methadone, so 60 30's is to 13 and a half 10mg methadones? Yeah uh fuck that.
Do you know of any other charts to check? .
When i did the calculations I got 675mg of dilaudid. So, if you are taking 1800mg of oxy the equal dose is 675mg of hydromorphone. now divide 675 by either 2mg or 4mg or 8mg and that is how many pills you should get in a month.
Sounds right to me.. Are you sure you didn't look at the morphine equivalent?
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When I did my calculations. If I did 4 30mg of oxycodone a day if I where to go to dilaudid I would have to take 82mg's. so orally, 120mg of oxycodone is equal to 45mg of dilaudid a day.
Good grief, that is a HIGH freakin' tolerance.
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High dose? Depends on the patient I guess.
I don't know if I did it wrong, I put in 1800mg of oxycodone (60 30mg pills, the amount i got scaled back because of the limit) and it said 900, I probably did it wrong because my eyes lit up as it said I would get 225 of the 4's instead. The doc had different Ideas lol)
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Believe me, actual pain patients are much higher.
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When I did my calculations. If I did 4 30mg of oxycodone a day if I where to go to dilaudid I would have to take 82mg's. so orally, 120mg of oxycodone is equal to 45mg of dilaudid a day.
Good grief, that is a HIGH freakin' tolerance.
I was doing ClayG's calculations.
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Just a little insight;
all that calculations are for responses in pain.
Just if some opiate is stronger that does not mean that buzz is stronger or euphoria. Opiates are analgetic and those charts are for pain response comparation.
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The Narcotic conversion is there to help the doctor not overdose/under dose the patient. Yea, you are right, the conversion tables are for analgesic equivalence, not high equivalence, lol. Also, it gives the recreational user a guideline to help him/her not OD. I use it on a regular basis. They even have it for the ipod, etc. but that's when it starts costing money...
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Yeah guys know your conversions but also know your opiates...dilaudid will give you a rush with a needle but 30 mg oxy will get you higher longer. Just know what you want in your recreational use when selecting your opiate then go to a conversion chart. :D
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When I did my calculations. If I did 4 30mg of oxycodone a day if I where to go to dilaudid I would have to take 82mg's. so orally, 120mg of oxycodone is equal to 45mg of dilaudid a day.
Good grief, that is a HIGH freakin' tolerance.
+1
Ladamercy!!!
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I just got an Opana 40mg ER, I have no tolerance to opiates and was wondering how much I should snort of the pill(or eat?) so as not to OD
or am I ok with the taking the whole pill at once
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I just got an Opana 40mg ER, I have no tolerance to opiates and was wondering how much I should snort of the pill(or eat?) so as not to OD
or am I ok with the taking the whole pill at once
No tolerance for opiates? At all? I would then start at 5mg at the most.
I have only had opana once when a friend gave me a 20mg er and I had a pretty good oxy habit at the time and that sucker lasted me 2 days.
So with that said start low and work your way up.
Be safe and have fun.
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so Im thinking Ill divide it into 1/4's and then sniff it? or eat it?
Im not a total opiate noob, Ive IVed heroin in the past, but that was a few years ago
I did read somewhere that IVing opana was a very risky thing to do, ie 1mg might be too much
weird how IVing and sniffing it could be so much more potent
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If you opiate naive, opana can be a very dangerous road. I would get a milligram scale, weigh the whole pill and then crush it up and take 2 or 3mg and then wait a bit, then repeat. If your naive, Id bet 5mg will make you nod and puke..
Be careful, and dont do it alone.. I've said it a million times, you can add, but you can't take away...
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start with 1/8th of the pill. be safe. 5mg nasal is like 2mg iv which is a good starting dose. (it should be plenty) it may be you need more because the pill is geling in your nose and not fully absorbing but play it safe.
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How to become an IV Junky in Four Easy Steps:
Level 1: Snort your heroin (cook up in a spoon, pull into a syringe, take needle off and squirt into nose).
Level 2: Upgrade to shooting a spike (needle) into your ass cheek. This high only lasts a few times, don't worry
Level 3: Increase your now (if not daily need) semi-regular habit to shooting into your asshole, or skin (IM).
Level 4: Now that you're tired of not getting as high as level 1, 2, and 3, complete your upgrade by IV'ing into your bloodstream. Your junky buddy will probably have to do it for you the first few times. But, seriously, who cares about abscesses, skin lesions, growing bacteria, or the fact that eventually you'll pawn all your shit for this wonder drug (which will make you look like death warmed over, and your clothes fall off?)
Congratulations, you've successfully completed all your levels! Sorry, certificates are not available at this time - they were pawned for the use of the author's last bag.
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when you go to stick a needle in your ass, do you aim for the inner anus, or the outer puckered part
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when you go to stick a needle in your ass, do you aim for the inner anus, or the outer puckered part
Happytree was talking about a syringe with no needle/pin.
Dat booty bump!
:D
nomad bloodbath
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I was just fucking around, sniff it, then stick a needle in your arm, non of that nancy pants stuff 4 me
any ways last night I snorted 5mg, felt opiate inebreated, but not the opiate zen feeling of contentment
y would anybody do opiates if it just got you fucked up feeling, its the zen contentment your after
so an hour laster, i snorted 5mg more, got more inibriated feeling, no zen, and bad mistake, I puked a bunch of times
fucker, so all you opiate feinds, what opiate will get you the zen master feeling of alls well in the my world(in an inibriated sort of way, so dont tell me to climb a mountain and meditate)
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I was just fucking around, sniff it, then stick a needle in your arm, non of that nancy pants stuff 4 me
any ways last night I snorted 5mg, felt opiate inebreated, but not the opiate zen feeling of contentment
y would anybody do opiates if it just got you fucked up feeling, its the zen contentment your after
so an hour laster, i snorted 5mg more, got more inibriated feeling, no zen, and bad mistake, I puked a bunch of times
fucker, so all you opiate feinds, what opiate will get you the zen master feeling of alls well in the my world(in an inibriated sort of way, so dont tell me to climb a mountain and meditate)
Sounds as though you have a low tolerance, which is good. So, there is no need for you to snort your opiates - in my opinion, unless you have dilaudids, and even then you need to keep snorting as it doesn't last long.
If you're just looking for the happy-go-lucky, "Zen" feeling, I would just ingest 1-2 Vicodins (5/500mg) or 1 Norco (10/250mg). Will give you same effect, will last longer and as long as you don't pop one every hour, you won't puke. But remember, young grasshopper, these "zen" feelings will require more and more ingestion and use of said opiates. Tolerance is a byyyyyatch!
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But remember, young grasshopper, these "zen" feelings will require more and more ingestion and use of said opiates. Tolerance is a byyyyyatch!
This! Try and take tolerance breaks, try making it a week between doses, and you remain relatively tolerance free. Plus, it will stop most negative effects from occuring.
Be careful and have fun :)
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Ive got some oxy 30mg IRs
how should I take these
No opiate dependance whatsoever. I remember a long time ago I chewed up an oxy40mg(not sure if it was ir or er) and it was awsome
snort?chew?squirt it into my buttocks?inject it into my eyeball?
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Ive got some oxy 30mg IRs
how should I take these
No opiate dependance whatsoever. I remember a long time ago I chewed up an oxy40mg(not sure if it was ir or er) and it was awsome
snort?chew?squirt it into my buttocks?inject it into my eyeball?
In my opinion, with no tolerance i would just swallow 1/2-1 full tablet. With no tolerance the med could lead to overdose consuming in other ways. People typically move on to other routes of administration once their tolerance prevents the oral route from working.
As a chronic pain sufferer and been on numerous meds over the years, I just swallow mine. I currently take Oxy 30 mg IR. I guess my situation might not be relevant because we are both looking for different things. Me=pain relief
you=good times.
Again just my opinion.
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agree with ready rock. if you have absolutely no tolerance, wait til you have an empty stomach and take half the pill. it will take a max 10 minutes to hit you and you will feel all of it. wait an hour and if you want to get higher/think you can handle it take the other half...wait for snorting a couple months down the line when eating doesnt get you high anymore, otherwise it's not worth the all the nastiness and feeling like a junky waaay before you have to
and to the guy that was gonna eat a whole opana, jesus christ man. if you had no tolerance you're lucky you didn't OD on 10 mg snorted. Opana has fucked me up more than any other snorted opiate ever, including heroin, and thats with a respectable tolerance going. A line from a 40mg opana has got to be like 10 x as strong a line of heroin. you're lucky the only thing that happened to you was throwing up. opana will fuck your shit UP.
whenever i know i've done enough opiate to be feeling zen but all i'm feeling is fucked up and on edge, i take a little bit of a benzo to calm me down a little. usually, this results in zen within half an hour.
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many years ago my grilfriend and i were slaves to the opiate. slamming heroin to be precise. the only good thing about street heroin is it's dirty, so when it's time you've had enough, the kick is PAINFUL but relatively short (a month or so, psyically... years more psychologically).
prescription opiates are pure, and from what i'v hear MUCH more difficult to kick. (esp methadone).
to whomever is listening to my rant, here, and is hooked on opiates, here is what i would do different now.
1) never touch the shit to begin with. (anyway the high is only good when you're sick. before then it just makes you naseaous)
2) to end an opiate addiction today i would first switch to kratom. it's natural, it's mild and it's kind of legal. then kick everything after a few weeks of that.
3) iboga. intense. sometimes horrific. but you have a chance at seeing why you use pills or dope to begin...plus it has the amazing attribute which let's you come out the other side of the trip without any withdrawals. It is a strong spiritual antidote to cure the strong spiritual disease of addiction.
getting off my soapbox now... thanks for listening! (crickets) :o)
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Ah i remember my first experience with opiates, about a year and a half ago when i had my wisdom teeth pulled, I got like 30 Oxycodone 5's, with 30 Ibuprophen 500's. Surprisingly the Ibuphrophen helped a lot more with the pain. So i saved all my Oxy's until after. Then took 1. The next night snorted one, the next night snorted 2, and then my intake kept going up from there. I was surprised by how tolerant i was. But then again i am a big guy, or it could just be in my head. Haven't messed with opiates in a while so hoping my tolerance has gone down a little, gonna invest in some 10mg's.
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Versailles, care to share your personal experience with Iboga?? I'm very interested.
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whats the easiest way to crush these things for insufflation (snorting)?
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whats the easiest way to crush these things for insufflation (snorting)?
what things? if you're talking about roxis or similar IR pills, i normally use a hose clamp - your car will have some in the engine compartment, but i bought mine at a hardware store for like 50 cents. they're little metal bands with slots punched out, and a tightening mechanism with a screw.
the underside of the clamp is rough metal, from the holes being punched out, so you run the pill along it like a cheese grater.
some people also use pill crushers which i guess you can get at a pharmacy
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hmmm. i tried to snort a norco last night but all it did was give me a headache and clog up my nose. . think i will just stick to oral
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hmmm. i tried to snort a norco last night but all it did was give me a headache and clog up my nose. . think i will just stick to oral
You really should switch to oxycodone/roxicodone if your going to snort your meds
The acetaminophen (Tylenol) in your norcos could cause problems depending upon amounts used
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hmmm. i tried to snort a norco last night but all it did was give me a headache and clog up my nose. . think i will just stick to oral
snorting norcos is pointless. You should do the cold water extract, where you grind up the norcos... google search for a tutorial.
If you are going to snort, do roxi 30s. 1 is like 3ish norcos.
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about 10% of an oral codeine dose is demethylated to morphine in vivo.
Which is a real bitch for LE. In my region, oral fluid swabs were recently introduced in road side testing.
Now everyone who has a cough and uses a cough remedy comes out positive for morphine...
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Before SR, I had mostly ingested or snorted a few times some vicodin & percocet over the years. Personally, experiences werent all that great so I didn't really see the draw of opiates (more a stimulant man myself).
Once I found SR, decided to try out grandaddy opiate. I got a teeny bag of H and proceeded to snort itty bitty lines. WOW ok this made me see why people go apeshit over opiates.
Don't even want to know how slamming it would feel. Never used a spike myself, and not about to start. The ol' tooter is just fine for administration for me. :)
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I originally created this conversion table on another forum, but I think the SR community could benefit from it as well. The conversion ratios have been established from a range of opioid conversion charts, online conversion tools and other solid information in order to even out some of the variance (and even outright mistakes) on some conversion sites. Sources at the bottom.
INTRAVENOUS
Morphine 10 mg IV =
Codeine - 120 mg*
Fentanyl - 0.1 mg
Sufentanil - 0.014 mg
Hydromorphone - 1.5 mg
Levorphanol - 2 mg
Meperidine - 75 mg
Methadone - 10 mg
Heroin - 6 mg†
Oxycodone - 20 mg
Oxymorphone - 1 mg
Buprenorphine - 0.3 mg
* only IM/SC route; IV codeine is lethal
† this is a pharmaceutical grade heroin dose (morphine diacetate or also known as di-acetyl-morphine); street heroin varies in potency and purity, so use with caution.
ORAL
Morphine 30 mg PO =
Heroin = 30 mg
Codeine = 200 mg
Hydrocodone = 30 mg
Oxycodone = 20 mg
Hydromorphone = 7.5 mg
Oxymorphone = 10 mg
Methadone = 5-10 mg†
Levorphanol = 4 mg
Meperidine = 300 mg
Tramadol = 150 mg§
Dihydrocodeine = 100 mg
Dextropropoxyphene = 130-200 mg*
† Note: Equianalgesic dosing ratios between methadone and other opioids are complex, thus requiring slow, cautious conversion
§ Tramadol is not a typical opioid, many even find it more stimulatory in effect and thus it will have varying effects from person to person
* Inconclusive data
Sources
http://www.agencymeddirectors.wa.gov/Files/OpioidGdline.pdf
http://www.agencymeddirectors.wa.gov/Files/2006FAQV8.pdf
http://www.medcalc.com/narcotics.html
http://www.globalrph.com/narcoticonv.htm
http://www.uofapain.med.ualberta.ca/For%20Professionals/Opioid%20conversion/Opioid%20conversion_PDF.pdf
http://www.emrpcc.org.au/Uploadlibrary/405204312EMRPCCOpioidConversion2010(Final).pdf%22]
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2) to end an opiate addiction today i would first switch to kratom. it's natural, it's mild and it's kind of legal. then kick everything after a few weeks of that.
x2
This is the first time I've seen kratom mention around these parts.
I totally second this. Kratom is very effective for WDs. I found it when I was looking for something to help get over a pretty bad percocet addiction. Brewing a tea from about 4-5 grams will give you about the same effect as taking 2 percocet. It made withdrawing from them very easy. Took about a month and I had very few symptoms.
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I took 8mg dilaudid orally and don't feel buzzed , i donot wanna use syringe or plug what do i do?
I sucked on 2 25 mcg fentanyls one after other and i donot feel sick does that mean am I highly opiate tolerant? ;D
I am almost new to opiates..
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I never went through the pill Phase/craze. I was crazy into Meth, and started mass producing it when i was 15. I guess you could say it was a family business. when i turned 18 I decided to get the hell away from that scene, so I joined the Army and bailed.
I ended up stationed in Europe, so i got hit by the whole Rave scene pretty hard. Other than H based extacy, i had never really fucked with Opiates.
In 2003 I was deployed to Afghanistan, I was and infantryman, so my job was kicking in doors and firefights. Some pretty intense shit, back then it was like the fucking wild west. The war was so new they didn't even know how to train us for combat in a mountain environment.
Anyways, The amount of H we came across in those mud huts and caves was unreal. so i ordered myself some rigs from Amazon filled up an empty canteen full (In hindsight, That was a lot of fuckin dope man:) I remember the first time i slid that plunger home. It was a million bumble bees racing towards my heart, and an eruption in my brain. my skin flushed with the warmth of a mothers embrace. I knew at that precise moment, I was fucked.
Actually to my surprise, I wasn't. (I'm still a daily injector, but I've maintained a moderate usage. 2x a day, and i no longer need to take my anti depressants, Anti anxiety, or sleep aids in the evening. For me it replaces all those. It's never effected my relationships with other people, or my job. Ive been a recreational drug user my whole life, and i will probably be until the day the scrape me outta my lazy boy (hopefully at a ripe old age).
Nothing in moderation can be a bad thing.
Quick story. I remember when I got blown up in 2004. I was fucked up pretty bad, and the doc kept giving me Morphine injections :) for some reason he went through three times the dosage he would have on a regular soldier before they started to take effect. .....hmm I wonder why that could be :)..............
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I<snip>
I ended up stationed in Europe, so i got hit by the whole Rave scene pretty hard. Other than H based extacy, i had never really fucked with Opiates.
In 2003 I was deployed to Afghanistan, I was and infantryman, so my job was kicking in doors and firefights. Some pretty intense shit, back then it was like the fucking wild west. The war was so new they didn't even know how to train us for combat in a mountain environment.
Anyways, The amount of H we came across in those mud huts and caves was unreal. so i ordered myself some rigs from Amazon filled up an empty canteen full (In hindsight, That was a lot of fuckin dope man:) I remember the first time i slid that plunger home. It was a million bumble bees racing towards my heart, and an eruption in my brain. my skin flushed with the warmth of a mothers embrace. I knew at that precise moment, I was fucked.
Actually to my surprise, I wasn't. (I'm still a daily injector, but I've maintained a moderate usage. 2x a day, and i no longer need to take my anti depressants, Anti anxiety, or sleep aids in the evening. For me it replaces all those. It's never effected my relationships with other people, or my job. Ive been a recreational drug user my whole life, and i will probably be until the day the scrape me outta my lazy boy (hopefully at a ripe old age).
Nothing in moderation can be a bad thing.
Quick story. I remember when I got blown up in 2004. I was fucked up pretty bad, and the doc kept giving me Morphine injections :) for some reason he went through three times the dosage he would have on a regular soldier before they started to take effect. .....hmm I wonder why that could be :)..............
A lot of guys who were in Vietnam had similar experience, and most were able to shake the habit, once they got home and out of the environment.
But some didn't. Some found out heroin is for life. Good luck, welcome home.
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I noticed people talking about this in a few posts in this thread so I thought I'd contribute. You CANNOT snort every single pill! You should NOT be snorting Vicodin, Norcos, Percs, etc. Think about how much powder you're actually putting up your nose, and how little of that powder by weight is the actual drug. For these pills it could be as little as 2% by weight, and you are snorting a LOT of powder. Once you coat your sinuses with powder, snorting any more is not going to do anything except block up your nose and damage your nasal membranes. Not to mention the acetaminophen in these pills can be harmful to your nose, and the fact that these pills work perfectly well taken orally.
For these reasons you should not snort any codeine or hydrocodone pills, nor any oxycodone pills less than 30mg/pill. You should not snort anything with Tylenol or Advil in it (Norco, Vicodin, Percocet, etc.).
It's true that some pills are better snorted than eaten -- this is true for Opana (oxymorphone) and Dilaudid (hydromorphone). These are probably a waste to eat and so should be snorted instead. I would start with 2-3mg oxymorphone or 2-4mg hydromorphone with no tolerance. Make sure you crush the pill into a very fine powder and use a rolled up piece of paper to make sure it actually gets into your nasal passages instead of just getting stuck in your nose. Even though you might feel like a bad ass using a dollar bill, do not put any currency in your nose that has been in your possession for less than 72 hours -- though it's unlikely, it is possible to contract Hep C from a dollar bill.
Stay safe guys, and keep those sinuses healthy. Not taking proper care of your nose (by snorting things you should) can lead to damage of the sinuses resulting in greater change of infection and even loss of sense of smell. You don't want that just to get high! Always do some research to make sure you should be snorting something before you just go and stick every powder you find up your nose.
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If hydrocodone->hydromorphone then why cant I shoot hydrocodone and it's get broken down to hydromorphone and get me off like dillaudid?
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Nice one, thanks for that. By the topic name, I actualy though you were referring to Opiate coversion lol, ie. codeine > morphine ect.
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Ahhh---the ol' Opiate topic, I love getting alerted that this topic has a new post, near and dear to me.
To the guy posting about his history (R8 something or other), I hope your name on the SR site is something different. Not to sound like a paranoid freak, or conspiracy theorist, but I learned a lot about you, and where you've been, and in which years, in just that little paragraph you posted. I always use the old adage around here, "never reveal anything too personal" - the most I get personal about is my drug of choice/preference (of the moment, which is good for me, because it changes a lot, lol.)
To the guy posting about the dangers of snorting any type of opiates, thanks for the reminder. Due to the overwhelming propensity, that there just very well may be some 12 or 13 year old newbie on here, looking for a quick fix, and having no clue, he/she may just decide to snort whatever he/she gets his hands on (I mean, lord knows that show Intervention shows you how to get off on just about ANYTHING these days).
For those of you who will be buying/wanting Norco/Vic/Percs and you should NOT be snorting them, there are a few methods for filtering your pills. Try googling, but the one that has been successful for me, is 1) Grind/smash your pill(s) to a powder form, the more powdery the better, 2) get a coffee filter (preferably the brown, non-bleached) and get it "damp". Place in the freezer for a few minutes. 3) Place filter over a cup. 4) place the powder you've ground into filter, and pour approximately 1/8 of a cup of water over the filter/powder. Voila, you should now have a liquid which is acetaminophen/filler (or damn near close to it).... free, and just drink and enjoy.
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heroine breaks down into morphine. oxycodone breaks down into oxymorphone. Hydrocodone breaks down into hyrdomorphone.
It's just a small fraction that is metabolised to the corresponding morphine analog, maybe 10%.
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Just wanted to add my 2 BTC's worth, don't snort Oxy/Hydro etc. the pills are made with binders and meant tho be swallowed. The binders are digested by your stomach acid and not meant to be absorbed by your nasal passages. Also, the bio-availability of snorting an Oxy is quite low, you will just waste quite a few of them to get the same effect of swallowing them. Be safe friends and to the Vet from Afghanistan in the previous post....Thank you, sincerely for your service!
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I was gonna start a new thread, but i figured i could get some good info right here on the opiate conversation.
Im interested in the differences in the high between Black Tar H, and Opium. I know the science behind the two and how each is made/ comes from, but ive never smoked raw or refined opium and just started getting into bth. How do they compare when smoked?
I would imagine opium takes a shit load of hits to get off, but can you get a nice nod on? Also does anyone prefer one to the other? Ive tried nearly every opiate on the market except the original pure opium, and believe me its on my to do list. Any info is appreciated. Thanks :)
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I was gonna start a new thread, but i figured i could get some good info right here on the opiate conversation.
Im interested in the differences in the high between Black Tar H, and Opium. I know the science behind the two and how each is made/ comes from, but ive never smoked raw or refined opium and just started getting into bth. How do they compare when smoked?
I would imagine opium takes a shit load of hits to get off, but can you get a nice nod on? Also does anyone prefer one to the other? Ive tried nearly every opiate on the market except the original pure opium, and believe me its on my to do list. Any info is appreciated. Thanks :)
I used to use opium in India and Kashmir when I didn't have heroin- most was raw opium (ie. not cooked to drive off moisture and to purify) It was usually the consistency of mollasses, the more bitter it is, the stronger it is ( Rasjasthani opium grown for pharmaceutical companies is actually slightly sweet in taste and is not as strong). Opium grown for pharmaceutical companies is not necessarily the strongest- sometimes they are more interested in the other alkaloids present AND they have the equipment to extract very efficiently, the cost of producing extra high quality opium from scratch is more expensive for them than the extraction methods they use in production!
Anyway back to subject- the effects of opium, subjectively, are slightly skewed as it was not exactly recreational as medicinal! At the time, I was smoking up to 10g of H a day- I found that 3 or 4 tola ( 1 tola =10g) of opium eaten, would get me nicely relaxed. From my perspective, there was not a great difference in the stone- opium, eaten, is not brilliant on the body, it can upset your stomach and on a long term basis, users tend to get muscle cramps and pains (not the cramps of withdrawl). You can certainly gouch on it, but I wouldn't exactly call it more dreamy than H. (The classical descriptions of opium use and dreams- see: Kubla Khan- Samuel Coleridge).
To smoke it,which is considerably the least efficient way to use it, it needs to be good opium to begin with- ie. cooked and boiled down with water, the scum skimmed off- which removes vegetative solids (this is done in bulk by the producer).The consumer then takes a small ball, enough for one smoke, then sweats it on a skewer over an oil lamp flame and wipes off the beads of moisture until they are gone, then it is ready for smoking- but, one needs an actual opium pipe, they are designed to distil and vaporize the opium. Without the proper tools, you are better to eat it. You can smoke it on foil, but it is messy, and because you have to keep the flame on as it bubble away, there is a danger of melting the foil and breathing aluminium fumes in (not good!) Sorry if this is a bit skewed, but I am writing after a hit of GreenGiants budder wax- which I can only say amazing things about!!
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No worries. Thanks for the answers +1. Holy shit though, 30 to 40 grams of opium? That would cost me $1000 bucks if i ordered it on SR. Smoking 10grams of H is a crazy high amount too, no offense, but im poor and could in no way support that kinda habit. Hmm so its like you need 4 times the amount of opium for a similar high to H? I think ill stick with H, and maybe when i hit the lotto ill order some opium, lol.
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So I recently traded some 120mg adderall for 30mg oxycodone, (poor deal, i know, but i have a lot of adderall). I've never done opiates before, and with that in mind, how much should I take? All 30 mgs or divide it in half? Or is it the sort of drug that i should split with my friend so we could get high together? What should I expect? What about coping with the comedown and "hangover"? Is 15mgs even enough to do much to a 150lb male?
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No worries. Thanks for the answers +1. Holy shit though, 30 to 40 grams of opium? That would cost me $1000 bucks if i ordered it on SR. Smoking 10grams of H is a crazy high amount too, no offense, but im poor and could in no way support that kinda habit. Hmm so its like you need 4 times the amount of opium for a similar high to H? I think ill stick with H, and maybe when i hit the lotto ill order some opium, lol.
That's the thing, I was only paying £3 / gramme for the H and maybe 10 pence per gramme for the opium!
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ok i dont understand all the jargon but heres what happened to me...i was self medicating for 3 years w/ ruptured herniated disc c5/c6 stenosis and spondylosis..i may not have spelled that right...i was taking mscontin 1 to 200 mg a day that whole time the last year i had to snort it to get any effect because i had built up my tolerence..well when i went to dr and he asked me to be honest w/ him i was...no point in lying he knew i was doing something to relieve pain just by looking at my mri...well when i told him how much i was taking he was shocked and immediatly put me on 7.5 vicodin 5 times a day and sent me to the pain clinic a week later my pain clinic dr after seeing the notes bumped me up to 5 10mg hydro a day and 3 5mg ir oxies for in between and over the following 2 months weaned or converted me from 200mg a day of morphine and zero pain relief to 3 10mg percocets a day and 2 of the 5 ir's for breakthrough pain il be honest more relief than id had in 3 years..im not sure if what ive said applies to any of the thread but i know that at the end of the day the way they weaned me off and switched me up was a formulated plan and if by what yall are sayin is correct im still taking about the same amount or slightly less in meds because of relative potency and dosing and while im not out of pain fully im what the dr called ''managed''and alot happier..and while i still get dopesick if i miss doses im alot healthier and happier for it...ty for listning and having great questions to reply to...il ramble if im allowed so il cut this short by saying please and thank you and if any1 can tell me if what i was taking and what i am taking are close id appreciate it id like to know if thats the case or if i was actually weaned down to a lower more theraputic dose...again please and thanks
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It's not known as the soldiers sickness for nothing. Guys I've been on 2X40mg oxycontins per day for 2 years can someone with experience tell me if I will be able to wheen myself off them easily or should I seek out IBOGAINE therapy? Regards - JWM
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So I recently traded some 120mg adderall for 30mg oxycodone, (poor deal, i know, but i have a lot of adderall). I've never done opiates before, and with that in mind, how much should I take? All 30 mgs or divide it in half? Or is it the sort of drug that i should split with my friend so we could get high together? What should I expect? What about coping with the comedown and "hangover"? Is 15mgs even enough to do much to a 150lb male?
It's a 30mg instant-release? Crush it up and snort half and see how you feel. The 30mg oxys are the best, bar none. My all-time favs.
Except for the original formula, crushable Opana 40mg. THAT'S my favorite pill of all time.
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CWE.
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Does no.3 produce a more euphoric high as opposed too no.4?? Which is better for someone with zero tolerance??
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Does no.3 produce a more euphoric high as opposed too no.4?? Which is better for someone with zero tolerance??
If you are injecting, with No.3, because it is not as pure as No. 4, the rush (No.3) can often have an unpleasant prickling sensation up the back of your neck and over your scalp. This is due to other opiates- either codeine or morphine being present, that is the only unpleasant part of the rush, because No.4 should be just pure heroin- the rush is sublime- you feel a warm rush up your neck and across your scalp- it feels like you are enveloped in a soft warm blanket of sheer bliss- the more intense, the more pleasant- as opposed to No.3, which can be too intense with the unpleasant prickles over-riding the pleasant aspects of the rush. Personally, as a person with methadone tolerance (prescribed daily) and even when I just had a heroin habit, I found snorting white to be a complete waste compared to the intense pleasure you get from IV use, smoking has even less effect. I should say that most of the white I have had was either produced near Benares in India or produced in Burma- smuggled to Thailand, then to India- the purities of both types typically being about 20%. I believe that if you get from source then it is strong enough to smoke as well.
Snorting No.3 can be very pleasant, I have had No.3 in India that was too dirty to smoke, but very nice when snorted, I believe this is because some of the active opiates in No.3 are destroyed or at least are not bio-available when smoked, but are absorbed when snorted, I always used to get a sort of band round my head- possibly from morphine content- it felt similar to the effects of morphine sulphate.
So, basically it depends on the way you intend to use it. I would always advise against injecting- it is very difficult to go back to smoking etc and often ends in deep vein thrombosis, amputated limbs, gangrene and septicaemia- usually because you run out of viable veins on your arms- then your hands and feet, then only the groin is left- which is when you start to run the risk of DVT etc.
I never got that far because I would never go in my groin and I do actually far prefer the ritual of smoking- you inject- flash- then a gouch if it is good- where as with smoking, you can spread it over an hour, maybe roll a few lines, then have a pipe of ganj, roll a couple more lines, have a gouch- and so on.
Hope this answers your question- take care!
Sorry just reread your question- Yes No.4 is more euphoric for a novice and I would recommend snorting it- IVing with no tolerance is akin to "Russian Roulette" played with 5 bullets in a six shooter!
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thank you bobhope for this helpful information! I plan on buying some H from either tomorrowman or FM,and i plan to only Snort,i enjoy chasing but with no4 u cant smoke it..also do you know if tomorrowmans H is No3 or 4?? becuz it only says top notch afgan
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thank you bobhope for this helpful information! I plan on buying some H from either tomorrowman or FM,and i plan to only Snort,i enjoy chasing but with no4 u cant smoke it..also do you know if tomorrowmans H is No3 or 4?? becuz it only says top notch afgan
Most Afghani H is No.3, but I recently read that they have started producing No.4- SR is not working for me at mo, so can't check his page, if he is U.S it could well be No.4 as I believe No.3 is very uncommon there.....Just checked page- it looks like No.4- looks white to me, but when in India, I used to get all sorts of colours, from dark brown (very "opiumy" nice!!!, to orange (not so good, purple- terrible- cooked up into a paste- from later research, I think it was H that had not gone through the full process to make No.3. The nicest No. 3 used to be almost white and had a slight burnt taste to it, but I reckon tomorrowmans is No.4.
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Hello SR!
For the past couple years, I've been shooting an 80mg oxy every 9 months, after spending two years using pretty much daily. Usually, I'll do 50-60mg first, wait about an hour, and do the rest. Now I'm getting some quality shit from Tomorrowman (amazing vendor btw), and it's my first purchase on SR as well as my first real H since 2006, since the area I'm in now is completely dry except for pharms. I'm hoping to get a really amazing rush, and do a little bit of nodding on my first shot, which should be Monday. It seems, though, that every single place online gives me a different estimation for how much I should do. My tolerance shouldn't be high at all. I had a day with some percocets a month and a half ago, and a month before that an 80mg oxy. Other than that, no opiates since last summer. The answers I've found online range from 10mg-150mg. I'm thinking 40 or 50 should be good, according to an earlier conversion? Any advice?
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Start low and work your way up. Its really the only way to be safe. Every one is different. Tomorrow mans shit is really strong too, so be extra safe.
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Yeah, I'm trying to keep it as safe as possible! My wonderful, non-judgmental friend is going to come hang out with me and make sure everything is cool while I test it out, and I was planning on doing the shoot half, see how it feels, shoot the other half if needed thing.
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Enjoy! (safely of course) ;)
Peace.
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i am rather confused how to calculate my cross tolerance percentage. I take about 180-200 mg of hydrocodone orally on a given day. i was trying to figure out what the equal dosage of oxycodone would be. can anyone help me out with what percentage i should enter into the converter? i would really appreciate it. pm me if you would. thanks!
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thx for the info on snorting vicodin, id been doing it- seemed same as oral, esp when i was sick with migraine or needed immediate relief, but i get that the APAP part is messing with my nasal cavities, and wasting some drug %. Feel dumb, but hey glad i know now.
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I've been very interested in fentanyl as of late. My question is what is a good dosage to start out with for a moderate opiate user but has recently quit using for a little over a month the method of delivery is insufflation.
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I am selling solutions of fentanyl - hell I must know this questions :D
However I dont inject it myself because I think its hard being successful doing IV on that strong and euphoric drugs.
250 ug - is this possible you think.
You want to get a very powerful IV tthat is...
If you are cautious and not tolerant start with only 50 ug.
Dont take this for a fact.
Its possible to inject and check if breathingproblem occur (then abort) and always wait a while before injecting more.
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Just to throw in my two cents on this thread:
I will NEVER IV anything. Something about putting a needle in your arm other than a doctor taking/extracting blood and that's as far as it goes with me, other than being in the hospital after a horrible accident and I need a morphine drip or something, but that's it.
If I have oxy/hydro with any sort of acetaminophen in it, I will crush it up and parachute it/ or do a CWE.
If I have pure oxy like roxies, then I snort those. I wish the Oxy 80s were crush able again, but apparently there is some way to get rid of the abuse-proof on it, but it is too much work and I don't have the time.
My favorite: the 30mg roxies to snort. Anything else, I will parachute or CWE, but that its it for me and its good.
Good Times!
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#3 H u have to have acid to break down to inject if thats what ur doing...But guys i have a question, iv got 2 30MG roxys coming the V cut kind and iv never triede those, i always use to get the Mbox ones then ppl started faking them so i havent done roxy in a while, also i found a new vendor who has original stop sign 15mg OPANA i got 2 for 30bucks and 1 xtra for 12, also i have 15 OP 80's comng someone gave me, does the microwave thing really work on the OP'S? O and hopefully that new girl from netherlands package is gonna make it to the usa,ugly doll? i think is her name she sent me .5 of her H and another guy just sent off .2 to try his black tar. I orderd all kinda shit for christmas...LOL o almost forgot subsandaddy stuff....thats my #1 guy....but serious do any of u know how good the V CUT roxys are? and microwave OPs?
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#3 H u have to have acid to break down to inject if thats what ur doing...But guys i have a question, iv got 2 30MG roxys coming the V cut kind and iv never triede those, i always use to get the Mbox ones then ppl started faking them so i havent done roxy in a while, also i found a new vendor who has original stop sign 15mg OPANA i got 2 for 30bucks and 1 xtra for 12, also i have 15 OP 80's comng someone gave me, does the microwave thing really work on the OP'S? O and hopefully that new girl from netherlands package is gonna make it to the usa,ugly doll? i think is her name she sent me .5 of her H and another guy just sent off .2 to try his black tar. I orderd all kinda shit for christmas...LOL o almost forgot subsandaddy stuff....thats my #1 guy....but serious do any of u know how good the V CUT roxys are? and microwave OPs?
HELL YES the "microwave thing" really works for the op oxies. I was skeptical as well until i found a good write up on how to do it and i tried it. I sucked off the outer coating and then ran the oxie over a pedi egg, you can use pedipaws or dremel for really fine powder, but anyway i ran it over the pedi egg until the powder was fine, it needs to be ground up good, then you put the powder on a plate, evenly spread, not all in one mound but not too spread out either! then you put in the microwave, ( glass plates will cook faster so be careful) then you watch it carefully, when ALL of the powder turns a nice golden tan color you stop the microwave immediately, then put the plate in the freezer, wait till its cold and pull it out, get a razor blade and scrape it up... you have a beautiful pile of opiate shards that you can chop up and shoot or chop up finely and snort, snorting is VERY NICE and gives you the original drip and taste. lovely. BTW when cooking the oxy, right before it will start turning the nice golden tan color, it looks like the powder melts down and turns translucent (see through) don't worry shortly thereafter it will start turning the golden tan color. hope that helps..
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Thanks, yeap it all worked out fine, I didnt know i could shoot it though, wish i would have known that sooner.lol.. But it damn sure did have the original OC taste//
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#3 H u have to have acid to break down to inject if thats what ur doing...But guys i have a question, iv got 2 30MG roxys coming the V cut kind and iv never triede those, i always use to get the Mbox ones then ppl started faking them so i havent done roxy in a while, also i found a new vendor who has original stop sign 15mg OPANA i got 2 for 30bucks and 1 xtra for 12, also i have 15 OP 80's comng someone gave me, does the microwave thing really work on the OP'S? O and hopefully that new girl from netherlands package is gonna make it to the usa,ugly doll? i think is her name she sent me .5 of her H and another guy just sent off .2 to try his black tar. I orderd all kinda shit for christmas...LOL o almost forgot subsandaddy stuff....thats my #1 guy....but serious do any of u know how good the V CUT roxys are? and microwave OPs?
HELL YES the "microwave thing" really works for the op oxies. I was skeptical as well until i found a good write up on how to do it and i tried it. I sucked off the outer coating and then ran the oxie over a pedi egg, you can use pedipaws or dremel for really fine powder, but anyway i ran it over the pedi egg until the powder was fine, it needs to be ground up good, then you put the powder on a plate, evenly spread, not all in one mound but not too spread out either! then you put in the microwave, ( glass plates will cook faster so be careful) then you watch it carefully, when ALL of the powder turns a nice golden tan color you stop the microwave immediately, then put the plate in the freezer, wait till its cold and pull it out, get a razor blade and scrape it up... you have a beautiful pile of opiate shards that you can chop up and shoot or chop up finely and snort, snorting is VERY NICE and gives you the original drip and taste. lovely. BTW when cooking the oxy, right before it will start turning the nice golden tan color, it looks like the powder melts down and turns translucent (see through) don't worry shortly thereafter it will start turning the golden tan color. hope that helps..
That's awesome I gotta try that.
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So Ive been looking into Fentanyl as well, and I can't seem to figure what exactly a safe dosage is, as nearly all resources on it are for pharmaceutical dosages for people with heavy opioid tolerance. I have NO opioid tolerance, and am either going to be administering my fentanyl through a nasal spray.
So what would be a safe dose? I've heard people saying go for 50ug, others saying don't go above 10ug.
"safe" dose being, what will kill me, and what's good to get high on?
also, for creating a fentanyl delivery system, I was thinking some fentanyl into a saline nasal spray bottle. Would that work? (and wht's average for ml to be consumed per snort?)
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So Ive been looking into Fentanyl as well, and I can't seem to figure what exactly a safe dosage is, as nearly all resources on it are for pharmaceutical dosages for people with heavy opioid tolerance. I have NO opioid tolerance, and am either going to be administering my fentanyl through a nasal spray.
So what would be a safe dose? I've heard people saying go for 50ug, others saying don't go above 10ug.
"safe" dose being, what will kill me, and what's good to get high on?
also, for creating a fentanyl delivery system, I was thinking some fentanyl into a saline nasal spray bottle. Would that work? (and wht's average for ml to be consumed per snort?)
If you have no opioid tolerance, there is such a fine line between a recreational dose, and a fatal dose, that, odds on, you will just OD, even heavy H users OD very often on fentanyl. The less tolerance you have, the finer that line is, and when you are talking about a drug that is measured ug's (not even sure what that unit is in comparison to, say, micrograms)....well.... remember to make your last will and testament.
If you really intend to go ahead, there appear to be at least one Dutch vendor selling nasal sprays, don't take my word for it- just had quick glance, they appear to be proper manufactured nasal sprays, not made up by some individual. If they are genuine- they should be of an accurate dosage/strength, wiki usually has the various LD50s of most drugs and the recreational- but even then, I would double check or triple check from a reliable site- just google "recreational dosage for fentanyl", then try a quarter of that amount first, different people can have different tolerances- check up on potentiators- if you were unknowingly taking something that is an opiate potentiator, I do know that grapefruit juice can make some drugs much stronger in effect (not sure if that applies to opiates, only recently got interested in the idea of potentiators). Last thing is, have a reliable friend with you, ready to call an ambulance, preferably someone that knows CPR.
Last, last advice is try smoking some No.3 heroin or snorting some white No.4 instead.
Good luck!!!!
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Hmmm. No reason I'm looking at fentanyl in particular, besides that every other opiate on here seems to be pricey as shit.
At that, do you have any suggestions for some decent priced opiates?
I was thinking about getting bulk codiene+promethaziene. If your average codeine dose is 100mg, the listing I was looking at won't get me nearly the hits I was wanting for the money if it's just codeine by itself. Anyone know how significant the potentiation is of promethazine? What about DXM? (i.e., increases it by a factor of 3)
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I've tried Nytol (Diphenhydramine) with heroin No.3, apparently, the one a night type is the one you need (has more in), I took 4, and although it certainly has some effect- I could not honestly say, for example- it doubled the effect of the H. This is because, it does not really mimic the H, or intensify, it is more as though you are taking another drug on top of the H. To a person with no H experience to compare it against, perhaps they would enjoy the effects, but to me, I don't really enjoy it- I am looking for the true effects of pure, powerful heroin, not this fucked up high.
As for codeine, it does not have the full range of enjoyable effects that heroin has, or BTH (no experience of). My favourite is some quality No.3 heroin, run up and down the foil, a quick one hit pipe of ganj, rol it up, roll it down, little hit of ganj, little nod, rol it up roll it down..... you get the idea!, most enjoyable way of wasting away the day!!!
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Cant say that im not a little jealous of you there Anon with all those goodies and that week ahead of you bub. Enjoy it!
I was reading about that microwave tek a few posts back and thats pretty bad ass. Could anyone give an approximate time for that before you stop it? Like how much time do I set my microwave for, and approx time for the cooking to complete. Is that really safe to shoot though?
I know this has been asked before, but does anyone have a easy tek that I could use to make #4 smokable? I know it would have to be made back into base form, but im not sure how to go about that exactly.
Thanks
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Well the general consensus seems to be that codeine sucks dick and fentanyl is not something to be fucked with(ironic that these were the opiates I was considering). Well, I'm looking for a cheap opiate. All the Rx hydrocodone and oxycodone or SR seems to be way overpriced. So that in mind, i'm looking for an opiate that is cheap, and has a high oral bioavailability.
Right now I'm looking into heroin(pricy, but seems only to be so in high doses). I'm thinking I can mix the powder at like 20-30 mg doses with like 100mg of DXM and then put that into a gel capsule.
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Well the general consensus seems to be that codeine sucks dick and fentanyl is not something to be fucked with(ironic that these were the opiates I was considering). Well, I'm looking for a cheap opiate. All the Rx hydrocodone and oxycodone or SR seems to be way overpriced. So that in mind, i'm looking for an opiate that is cheap, and has a high oral bioavailability.
Right now I'm looking into heroin(pricy, but seems only to be so in high doses). I'm thinking I can mix the powder at like 20-30 mg doses with like 100mg of DXM and then put that into a gel capsule.
Sorry to stymie your ideas! But.... heroin whether No.3 or No.4 has a very low absorption when you eat it- much better to snort- No.4 (if you don't inject-which is akin to "Russian Roulette" unless you have experience, tolerance tec, or smoke No3, snorting No.3 can be very nice- some batches seem better suited to this ROA (route of administration) than others (in my experience).
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Isn't No 4 Heroin just pure diacytlmorphine? I'm pretty sure I read from a reputable source that diacytlmorphine has like 60% oral bioavailibity.
I would also like to point out that when writing "diacytlmorphine", it was auto corrected to "anthropomorphic".
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anybody here have any experience/tips on making Monkey Water with tar heroin and water?
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Monkey water? Yea when u mix your tar and water and instead of inject drip it in your nose?
Bro you would be better off buying #4 IMO
Also to the guy asking about
Mrdutchguy the one with the nasal and pure fent powder, if u have no opiod tolerance i would shot one shot in your nostril and see how that does first man,seriously that is POTENT SHIT!! my best friend died from it..
Iv got a couple grams on the way from MR dutch guy but iv got a 10+ year opiate tolerance, i could at onoe time In my heavy heavy use days like up tpo 4 80mg oc (the original ones a day) i could open a gel patch 100MCG and lick it all and be fucked out my mind...
see fent doesn go by MG useually it goes by MCG-MICROGRAMS 100mg would drop u dead as a fucking corpse..lol
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byner I gotta tell you the truth dude, opiates are expensive. and if you serious about getting the best bang for your buck, you might have to put your nose to work a little.
if your only doing it once and a while it wont do much damage, just dont go sniffing anything with binders in it such as those nasty gels they put into pills nowadays.
don't get the fentanyl that's just suicide.
oxycodone is the shit but its real expensive. but for an occasional high the $15-30 tops it will take someone with a low tolerance to get fucked up(and I mean it WILL get you fucked up) on a roxy is well worth it.
#4 looks to be affordable if you buy it in a little bit of a larger amount than just a bag(.250-1gram)